The Bible says clearly that Paul in his words said he was a Paharisee and he that he sat under the teachings of Gamaliel. Er was the first person God killed for being wicked ( Gen 38:7 ). Matthew built on Marks work, using it as a backbone, and filling out more background details, and references to The Law, The Prophets, and Psalms, etc. Your name never appears in the Bible after your appointment as the 12th Apostle in Acts 1. And most of all, he wouldnt of been able to defend the Gospel in such a way as if he did not have the correct teaching. Gamaliel said success would determine the truth of the movement. Lets listen to the voice of Jesus first, and get our priorities straight. Removing that aspect will cause misunderstanding of what they were teaching. Infact, the sect that condemned Yeshua were Sadducee. Gamaliel is mentioned a couple of times in Scripture as a famous and well-respected teacher. Islam is the truth, Allah Akbar/God is Greatest. To think that all Jewish people were completely unified is to share the same fantasy Christians have about the early church. But there is a notable difference in Paul from pre- to post-conversion. Is AARP PO Box 93143 Long Beach CA 90809-9720 a valid address? These lines of reasoning all go back to the false idea that Paul must have been right and Paul couldnt possibly be wrong, so whatever Paul was thinking at the time must have been correct, and we just have to figure out what Pauls intended meaning was and what Paul was really thinking when he wrote these words. That would mean that your opinion about the unknowable unwritten mind of Paul becomes the Word of God. No. Im sorry that Christians cant come to grips in their confirmation bias that both Yeshua and Pauls ministries was infact Judaism.. It seems that people want to limit the intervention of God in the lives of people he intends to use. But, Once an idea has been accepted by your subconscious, it remains there and it governs your behavior until it is replaced or changed. [ as a pastor named Bishop Dale C. Bronner observed in one of his sermons]. And I need to save a throne for my mom, or shell be mad. Im following Jesus. And no one, not even Paul, ever said that all Scripture was equal. Jesus was asked twice, by two different men, the same basic question about which is the most important or greatest commandment in the Law. Peter doesnt point to himself, or his own words, or all Scripture or The Bible, Peter doesnt claim his own words are the word of God, and he doesnt claim that he doesnt need a second witness. (check out wikipedia on yeshiva, that will give you a feel for a Torah / talmudic education, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeshiva), I could careless who Saul aka Paul studied with ,the fact that someone studies does not hold anything within that person thinking or make up. We dont have time for debates about which one is first. Meaning people who believed in the Moshiach as Yeshua. Thanks also for your series on New Perspectives. My view is very similar to the traditional Orthodox view of the texts of Scripture for almost 2000 years. Why believe a self-described co-redeemer holy spirit comforter who claimed; I became your father, therefore I urge you to imitate me? Then those who finished the garage can go help the others finish the house., One worker objected: But Boss Paul, those were not the owners instructions! He is also quick to associate with gentiles, so he does not have a deep-seated hate for Romans in general as well. Well Maybe that spirit isnt the Holy Spirit of Jesus, maybe you are bound in spirit by the evil spirit of Paul the Pharisee. We'll address more of this in a moment. He calls himself "of the people of Israel.". There are three things bearing on this subject among the incidental intimations which we have in respect to the early history of Saul, viz. There were at least 2 elements of Paul's training. He was an expert in the law. St. Gamaliel, also Gamaliel the Elder or or Rabbi Gamaliel I (Hebrew: ; Greek: ) was a Pharisee who was a leading authority in the Sanhedrin, a doctor of the Law (Acts 5:34-40), and the teacher of St Paul (Acts 22:3). Long has taught full time at Grace Christian University since 1998, specializing in Bible and Biblical languages. ). If Paul began study at the latest age of 16, we can guess a birth year of about 6 at the earliest. How about you? (Acts 8:1-2, 9:1-2) It is easy to gather from his writings that Paul was a very passionate person all around. Or does he break away from Gamaliel and the Pharisees in other ways? So what is the application of this parable? xl. How long did it last? Paul undermined Apollos and heretically claimed I became your father. Or the series on Jewish Christianity starting here: https://readingacts.com/2018/01/18/introducing-jewish-christian-literature/. Ill do it then. This is simply not the case and you need to read a bit more widely than you have. Phillip J. Long- Sorry i have nothing to learn from replacement theology or of Constantine Christianity followers who believe that somehow eventhough the book is filled with Jews or converts practicing Judaism is magically replaced by ridiculous made up church doctrine. Dr. Ron Mosely and the archaeology team has gone through great lengths to disprove your theory by presenting actual archaeological evidence. If he didnt have the teaching and influence then he wouldnt of had such a bold and confidence approach when speaking to other people. But it begs the question Why would early Christians claim Rabban as one of their own? Therefore, what Saul was taught was not based off of Gods truth. He was the son of Simeon ben Hillel and grandson of the great Jewish teacher Hillel the Elder. Acts 21:39 - "But Paul said, ' am a Jew from Tarsus, in Cilicia, a citizen of no mean city . Very much the contrary. According to Jesus, which Commandment is the Most Important? If the Hillel tradition did not offer plasticity enough to justify Pauls missions against Christians, is it possible that Paul felt that he stayed basically faithful to Gamaliel/Hillels school and to mercy because the predominant number (majority of cases) of Pauls concrete cases against Christians did not require threats of death (i.e., how many Christians caved in?). To teach the bible, it is mandatory to teach from a Pharisaic background. Thanks, Andrew. When Hillel died in 10 AD, his son Simon (Gamaliel's father) took over Hillel's position as the nasi, which means president, of the Sanhedrin. Pauls speech and thought directly lines up with the teachings of Hillel. However, there are other times when Paul puts his Christian beliefs and what Jesus has to say before the Pharisaical rules and is willing to break a rule or be mocked for something and instead, do something Jesus way. They all teach we should be like Paul and we should listen to Paul without examining Pauls life and Pauls teachings in the light of the teachings of Jesus in Scripture. You will be called Rocky. . Paul might indeed have been a follower of the School of Shammai, but his mentioning Gamaliels name might have been intended to his (Pauls) having studies in Jerusalem when Gamaliel was head of the Sanhedrin. Basically, he said that if the movement is from God then it cannot be stopped, if it is not then it will not succeed. So no there was zero Christianity in the book of Acts. I would not limit the intervention of God in the light of Pauls claim in Galatians 1 that God had prepared him before he was born for the grace he has received (Gal 1:15). We need to carry this out, with our own God-given abilities and talents, using the skills, and circumstances we have. Written in stone. What could be more permanent than that? Is it possible that Paul did conceive of certain individual missions against Christians as consistent with a rendering of mercy, that is, mercy to the stability of cultural Judaism rather than mercy to minority Jews (i.e., Christians)? Here are 3 examples. There well over 20 sects of Judaism during Yeshua time. (Paul insisted that all the workers show respect for him by addressing him as Boss Paul.) Paul called the team of painters together and told them: Boys, we need to paint this garage and house. The false teaching about one rule is the false teaching of the Pharisees of Pauls day, and Paul the Pharisee was pushing this false teaching. Galatians: Freedom through Gods Grace (Wipf & Stock, 2019). Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. I dont know of a single church that simply teaches the Bible simply and preaches the whole counsel of God, including Pauls sins and mistakes. It is a Rembrandt. But we surely can trust that Paul was as Acts 22:3 states: I am indeed a Jew, born in Tarsus of Cilicia, but brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel, taught according to the strictness of our fathers law, and was zealous toward God as you all are today.. Polhill goes on to talk about Paul studying Greek and by him studying under Gameliel and Hellenism, he would be around the gymnasium. Gamaliel. There is so much theological supposing these days! Who did Apostle Paul study under? Beware of the NAR whale its really a killer whale with a man-made horn strapped on top. Three hours, noon to 3 pm. For example, I talk a bit about this issue in these posts: https://readingacts.com/2013/08/29/the-new-perspective-on-paul-did-paul-convert-to-christianity/, https://readingacts.com/2013/09/08/paul-and-judaism/, https://readingacts.com/2017/09/04/was-paul-a-pharisee/. What were Pauls specific sins as a Christian? it seems like Gamaliels statement would be a good point to make in sharing the gospel message with people of the Jewish faith. If you dont ask about Pauls sins, I wont tell about them. Who was Gamaliel in the Bible? (11). Gamaliel was a Pharisee and a grandson of the famous Rabbi Hillel. Paul was accustomed to learning from his elders as he developed as a Pharisee (Galatians 1:14). Well then, I will stop responding to you since you are not interested in learning anything which does not conform to your already-made-up mind. I think Sam is right (somewhere up the thread), one can differ from his teacher, sometimes radically. Pharisee ruled that executions created a bloody Sanhedrin and if you had more than one a year, it was considered a bloody Sanhedrin. He states not only is he a Pharisee, but where he studied and what tribe he is from. This also convinces me that even though it seems he split from Gamaliel, early on, that did not change him into something completely opposite. Gamaliel was the grandson of Hillel, the most renowned rabbi in Jewish history. When he was younger, he used to have the great theological insight about territorial spirits and wrestling with dark angels. Yes, 99.9% of Christians absolute gets Pauls writings wrong. I appreciate your many responses to this thread.as I wrote this response you have added a few more! His seeds are seeds of oppression and bondage. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men. [Isaiah 29:13]. is his own writings Acts 22 22-29. now there is the whole case of Paul a true liar. You can hover over the pic and it will say that (or at least it did for me in Firefox). You should have hired a PR firm to promote your name and make if famous. Yes you clearly are removing them from Jewish culture and using Constantine-Christianity and replacement theology to float most of your website. The testimony of Jesus is the voice of Jesus, (The Red Letters,) recorded by the 11 faithful witnesses, the True Apostles that Jesus personally appointed and trained for over 3 years. Rome is the city that sits on seven hills, the perfect place for Peter the Roman, the New World Pope for the New World Order, to replace the original Apostle Peter in the apostate church of the Antichrist. a. The revelation of the Gospel directly from Jesus Christ (Gal 1:12), most probably in Arabia. Paul wrote: The entire law is summed up in a SINGLE command: Love your neighbor as yourself. [Galatians 5:14, Leviticus 19:18], And again, Paul wrote: He who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. People tend to forget that Yeshua himself stated that we are to listen to the Pharisees for they sit in the seat of Moses. Probably his training with Gamaliel would have been concluded by the time he was twenty and would have given Paul a very good understanding of Old Testament Scripture. But we dont need to put words in the mouth of Jesus, we can let Jesus speak for himself, and we can listen to Him and obey Him. What ends up as what we call Christianity and Judaism today both some out of the turmoil of the first two centuries. I am trying to understand this whole post, but think the discussion is mainly about Paul and why he acted the way he did in persecuting christians after studying under Gamaliel who was more concerned with non violent acts. Or is it possible that Paul privately harbored more overall agreement with Gamaliel/Hillel than with Shammaite Pharisees, and that Paul felt himself to be a lone dissenter in rare cases (Christians) against his former masters legal hermeneutics of mercy? Its not like there is a reason to believe a man who said, If my FALSEHOODS abound to Gods glory why am I being judged a sinner.?. It bothered Peter so much that G-d sent him a vision regarding gentiles coming into the faith. Which is why he had to go to Sinai (which is in current day Saudi Arabia). Did paul study under gamaliel? So 7:12 cannot stand alone as One Commandment. He was an ultra-conservative reacting to what he perceived as a dangerous liberal view (Jesus was the Messiah and the High Priest killed him!). How did Gamaliel impact Paul? Supposition isnt the problem. There will always necessarily be a need for supposition and inference. So the biggest problem with the church in Corinth was Paul himself, and his abusive absentee leadership style. Jesus Leadership Training, The Book of Enoch for Beginners: A Guide to Expand Your Understanding of the Biblical World. Maybe, from what I have seen of him he does not go to great lengths on anything. The New Testament was not written nor codified till well after both Yeshua and Shaul were gone. Have heard some scholars saying that If Paul was living in the 21 century he would have had 5 phd, how true is that. The notion was given classic expression only a little more than a century ago by the biblical scholar John William Burgon. But that was the requirement Jesus gave to sit on thrones: You are those who have stood by me in my trials. You, speaking to His 11 Apostles who had been walking with Him faithfully for 3 years. (I know, captain obvious). Yes I agree its a commandment given by Jesus, its not optional, and it applies to us today. Evidence for this more accommodating opinion is found in the book of Acts, although some (like Chilton) are not completely convinced Acts portrays Gamaliel accurately. Therefore, in times when there is no clarity, we should end there and not come up with our own assumptions. Why is it so hard to give a straight answer to this simple question? They believe after reading his writings the law is done away with, you can eat what you want and he was anti Judaism. God bless you all. He had nowhere to sleep, and had to go stay in a hotel for several days. That is why there was no mention of Believe and be saved The New Covenant was not even inaugurated until the Last Passover Supper and the 2 Commandments are clearly described in 1st John. Exactly what Issa p al Masih did about 500 years earlier! That is the order of address in near eastern culture and especially the Sanhedrin, being the Nazarite or the one ran by corrupted Pharisee and Sadducee. While Gamaliel was seemingly somewhat relaxed in his view of the Torah, Paul seemed to take it so seriously, that he believed the Christians truly did deserve to be persecuted for believing in a false Messiah. at the feet of Gamaliel"). Paul claims to have been educated by Gamaliel, one of the premier teachers of the Law in the first century. therefore I urge you to imitate me, and I have become all things to all men. Paul thinks hes Boss, and doesnt need to listen to your instructions that I gave him.. As an athlete and sports enthusiast, the references really stuck out to me and are passages of scripture that I have read multiple times. Yet Jesus is the object of worship, turned into a false god believed to be confirmed in a book that actually refutes it! It seems that Pauls upbringing and learning under Gamaliel would have to play some role in the way that he thought, taught, and formed his theology. Mantra: ..and Muhammad is his prophet., .3) Paul the Pharisee, the self-appointed Apostle to the Gentiles, whose 13 letters comprise one third of what, today, we call the New Testament. (The first, original New Testament was composed by the second century heretic Marcion, and he coined the term New Testament. His new book contained nothing except 10 of Pauls letters and an abbreviated Gospel of Luke. What is a common analogy for a permanent decision? Romans 10:4 states For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. When Paul was arrested, he told the people and the authorities, "I am a Jew, born in Tarsus in Cilicia, but brought up in this city, educated at the feet of Gamaliel according to the strict manner of the law of our fathers, being zealous for God as all of you are this day" (Acts 22:3). I admit this is all speculation and I dont have a shred of evidence for any of this but it makes me wonder if Paul was trying to start something extraordinary within Judaism (As he mentions in his defense in Acts 22) and God harnessed that ambition for the glory and advancement of His Church. Not to mention I highly doubt you have a Phd in any area of academia or even known any grasp of Hebrew or Greek. Since I am teaching through Paul and his Letters again this fall, I thought I would revisit that older post and provide some additional thoughts on Gamaliel as background for reading Paul. Having other ideas that moves us away from the scripture is tantamount to adding or subtracting from the Word which we are forbidden to do. His dissertation was published as Jesus the Bridegroom by Pickwick Books in 2012. Do you have a reference handy mentioning Gamaliel in the Clementine lit? He wrote the book on NT theology, and developed a missionary strategy that evangelized the western Roman empireso maybe three or four degrees at least. Im sorry to shatter your confirmation bias but YEshua nor Paul were Christians. Not others in the future who will follow the risen Jesus Christ. This is a question of fact about the content of the text in the 66 Books of our Bible. Friend, I want to hire you and your team to paint my house and my garage. The Lord Our God is ONE God Greatest Commandment according to the Messiah (p). Somehow Barnabas who was at the Pentecost knew Saul! Hes an Liberal heretic !!! Wow, that Love Song concert was groovy, man. Perhaps on the basis of a preserved tradition that he oversaw the body of St. Stephen. Sticking with Acts, Gamaliel counsels caution in Acts 5, Rabbi Saul seems to abandon caution by Acts 7. .b) What about the so-called Great Commission? I feel that (not competent to know) clusters of questions like these make me second-guess just how far N.T. The only place in the New Testament that mentions anything like Seven Mountains is Revelation 17, seven hills on which the woman sits. (The Great Prostitute, that is.) His dissertation was published as Jesus the Bridegroom by Pickwick Books in 2012. So Law, Prophets, scripture is what it is divided into. Study with Quizlet and memorize flashcards containing terms like Definition of 'epistle', 5 Common Denominators of an Epistle, T/F - Christ is a relationship not a religion and more. (Acts 16:1-10). Why ignore the words of our Lord God Jesus Christ, Son of Yahweh the Most High God of Israel, who came to fulfill the Law and the Prophets? ), Phillip, In your other post on Paul and Gamaliel http://readingacts.com/2013/09/09/paul-and-gamaliel/ You said, QUOTE: There are some good reasons to investigate Pauls claim to have been educated by Gamaliel. Sages of the time didn't have formal recognition or title. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. Once we allow things that we can not say with certainty, we give a foothold to the enemy to sow his seed too. This notion is wrong. George Clinton? maybe not. Here are answers to 2 common objections: .a) What about the so-called Golden Rule? . The will of God is plainly revealed, showing all that man is to do, to be, to suffer, and enjoy. This article is the result of when you remove the culture/context of the scriptures, the Hebraics of the Brist Chadasha (Renewed Testament) and injecting the christian outlook that Shaul (Paul) divorced his Jewish roots. / Line ID 0840450211. Note also that there were more than one Rabbi named Gamaliel. Terms in this set (31) Where was Paul born? We know that as a young man Paul studied under the tutelage of Rabbi Gamaliel in Tarsus, who provided him with an expert knowledge of the Hebrew Scriptures ( Acts 22:3 ). 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Christianity starting here: https: //readingacts.com/2018/01/18/introducing-jewish-christian-literature/ here: https: //readingacts.com/2018/01/18/introducing-jewish-christian-literature/ Biblical World all the show. Teach the Bible, it is sin living in me one God Greatest Commandment according to Jesus which! And his abusive absentee leadership style or Greek Paul undermined Apollos and heretically claimed I became your father, I! Counsels caution in Acts 1 a bloody Sanhedrin and if you had more than a century ago by second... Teachings of Gamaliel for Beginners: a Guide to Expand your Understanding of the first century said all. A pastor named Bishop Dale C. Bronner observed in one of his sermons ] had to!