is infinity times infinity indeterminate

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Due to the constant light reflection between opposing mirrors, it seems that there is a boundless amount of space and repetition inside of them. things. You can also think of it as being the Any number multiply by infinity is infinity or indeterminate. Limit of $\sin x$ as $x$ tends to infinity. The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". In ordinary arithmetic, the expression has no meaning, as there is no number that, when multiplied by Same thing is true if $a_n \to \infty$ and $b_n \to \infty$. In this case, if the numerator is other than zero, then we say that the operation is undefined. Indeterminate applies to limits. If so, these would be the easiest and safest way to perform these checks. But I guess they are ok. indeterminate does not mean what you think it means, it is used to describe the contents of uninitialized variables and dangling pointers. this might also work (but involves call to exp() and testing equality of doubles): Thanks for contributing an answer to Stack Overflow! For example, 1 divided by infinity results in zero, but infinity divided by infinity is indeterminate. Namnet Stockholm All Stripes r en referens till regnbgen och regnbgsflaggan, som i ordet all stripes of the rainbow. You also get easy integration with Infinity DriverClub, your free roadside assistance membershipall in the palm of your hand. Those two functions were my preliminary thoughts and was wondering if I was missing anything. Web* In this video: why is 1^INFINITY an indeterminate form? [math]1^{\infty}[/math] is an indeterminate form, yes, though the reasoning presented in the original post doesn't entirely work, since, as mentioned, infinity isn't simply a number we can toss in for the purposes of arithmetic. Since the sine of \(0\) is \(0\), you can now evaluate the limit, obtaining: \[ \lim_{x \to 0^+} \left( \frac{\cos{x}}{x}-\frac{1}{x}\right) =0\], This indeterminate form comes as the expression, You cannot use L'Hpital's rule because of the product of two functions, so all you need to do is to rewrite the product as a fraction by recalling that, \[ f(x) \cdot g(x) = f(x) \cdot \frac{1}{\frac{1}{g(x)}}.\], \[ \begin{align} f(x) \cdot g(x) &= f(x) \cdot \frac{1}{h(x)} \\ &= \frac{f(x)}{h(x)}. Here is an example involving the product of zero and infinity. If you add infinity (an impossibly large number) plus another impossible large number the result is still an impossibly large number (infinity). How do you check for infinite and indeterminate values in C++? Identify your study strength and weaknesses. Webplural infinities 1 a : the quality of being infinite b : a space, quantity, or period of time that is without limit 2 : an indefinitely great number or amount 3 : a point infinitely far away More Double-sided tape maybe? into 0 1/ or into 1/0, for example one can write lim xxe x as lim xx/e xor as lim xe x/(1/x). You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. Find their customers, contact information, and details on 64 shipments. If t tends to infinity, find Q? Consider the following limit.\[ \lim_{x \to 4} \frac{x+4}{x-4}.\]Is this an indeterminate form? Let's apply the L'Hopital's Rule to the given It is crucial that you have a grasp on what L'Hpital's rule is and how to use it to evaluate limits. How were Acorn Archimedes used outside education? . Chemical Engineering, Alma Matter University for M.S. How can I represent an infinite number in Python? function by taking the derivative of numerator and denominator with This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. and still equals Since the trigonometric functions at the above equation are all cancelled and the constant is left, then we cannot substitute the value of x. In multiplication you are looking at a certain number of sets of is a special case of a nonexistent limit. Hos oss kan alla, oavsett kn, sexuell lggning, etniskt ursprung, nationalitet, religion och lder trna och utva idrott i en milj som r fri frn alla former av trakasserier eller diskriminering, och som uppmuntrar till rent spel, ppenhet och vnskap. respect to n as follows, Again, apply the L'Hopital's Rule to the above equation, we have. EXPLORE Q50 Power through another big day Q60 Richly appointed inside and with a V6 engine. The indeterminate form of zero times infinity is transformed as follows:. What are the "zebeedees" (in Pern series)? Do peer-reviewers ignore details in complicated mathematical computations and theorems? In this case, we have to consider the Method 1 in solving the given limits. However, these are not the only indeterminate forms. Indeterminate means "knowing it has this form is not enough to tell you the answer". Infinity over zero is undefined, or complex infinity depending ln L = ln ( lim x x 1 / x), and use the fact that the Realintruder, But Infinity Infinity is an indeterminate quantity. 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Not if you multiply one by itself infinity times. There is no number greater than infinity. Label the limit as L and find its natural logarithm, that is. Infinity times 0 equals any number because infinity (1-1) which it is equal to, is equal to anything. Den 4 juni gick Stockholm All Stripes internationella bowlingturnering Strike a Pose av stapeln i Stockholm fr andra gngen i historien. Powered by Invision Community. In this type of Indeterminate Form, you cannot use the L'Hopital's Rule because the L'Hopital's Rule is applicable for the Indeterminate Forms like 0/0 and/. \end{align}\], As \(x \to 0^+\), the natural logarithm goes to negative infinity, so the above expression is an indeterminate form of \(0 \cdot \infty\), which you can work using some algebra, \[ \begin{align} \ln{L} &= \lim_{x \to 0^+} x\ln{x} \\ &= \lim_{x \to 0^+} \frac{\ln{x}}{\frac{1}{x}}, \end{align}\], \[ \begin{align} \ln{L} &= \lim_{x \to 0^+} \frac{\frac{1}{x}}{-\frac{1}{x^2}} \\ &= \lim_{x \to 0^+} (-x) \\ &= 0. Primed to Perform Most (but not all) indeterminate forms involve infinity in some way. These cookies ensure basic functionalities and security features of the website, anonymously. All rights reserved. Would Marx consider salary workers to be members of the proleteriat? But even if you had an old compiler, I'd not go with this Microsoft-only solution. Since the answer is -/, then it is an Indeterminate Form which is not accepted as a final answer in Mathematics. How did adding new pages to a US passport use to work? What grade do you start looking at colleges? is the better method especially if the rational functions cannot be Indeterminate Form - Zero Times Infinity. Since the answer is 0 which is also another type of Indeterminate Form, it is not accepted in Mathematics as a final answer. We know that any number multiply by zero is always equal to zero but there's an exception, which is infinity. Therefore, we cannot say that infinity times zero is zero. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Create and find flashcards in record time. Which of the following isnotan indeterminate form? Doing business as:Infinity Pharmaceuticals Inc, Members (2):Richard Klausner / Product Manager But Infinity Infinity is an indeterminate quantity. We know that any number multiply by zero is always equal to zero but there's an exception, which is infinity. This website is also about the derivation of common formulas and equations. $$\lim_{t\to+\infty}e^{-\frac{Rt}{2L}}=0$$. Now, 0 also is meaningless, since anything times infinity is infinity and anything times 0 is 0, so infinity times zero cannot be determined. Best Answer. In mathematics, division by zero is division where the divisor (denominator) is zero. Other uncategorized cookies are those that are being analyzed and have not been classified into a category as yet. The cosine of \(0\) is \(1,\) so both the numerator and the denominator approach \(0\) as \(x \to 0.\) This suggests the use of L'Hpital's rule, that is: \[ \lim_{x \to 0^+} \left( \frac{\cos{x}}{x}-\frac{1}{x}\right) = \lim_{x \to 0^+}\frac{\sin{x}}{1}\]. I get indeterminate when I divide zero by zero. From the link @legends2k posted, it appears, as far as i know, you should also put ::is_iec559 into your static assert, since the x!=x will only work if your implementation implements the ieee754 standard. The other indeterminate forms are the following: These indeterminate forms can also be solved using L'Hpital's rule, but as the rule requires rational expressions, you will need to do a bit of algebra before applying the rule. WebA limit confirmed to be infinity is not indeterminate since it has been determined to have a specific value (infinity). So, the answer to the question is that infinity times infinity is it seems to me that any number multiplied by zero will always still end up zero. without bound when x gets extremely large. +8. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. Can you divide \(0\) by \(0\)? No . $(A \cos wt + B \sin wt) = \infty$, if $t$ tends to infinity is it? Infinity having a power equal to zero is also undefined hence it is also a type of indeterminate form. Description: The mission of Infinity Pharmaceuticals, Inc. is to discover, develop, and deliver to patients best-in-class medicines for the treatment of difficult-to-treat diseases, Its a comprehensive, 360 approach that looks out for you at every turn. However, what does some very large number divided by another very large number even mean? So, when you multiply 0 by infinity, you get 0. How to rename a file based on a directory name? WebInfinity Minus Infinity. I'd recommend using isfinite, though, or packaging this test into a function/macro called something like isfinite so you can get rid of it all when the time comes. The problem is how to test if a variable is infinite or indeterminate. rev2023.1.17.43168. Infinity times 0 equals any number because infinity (1-1) which it is equal to, is equal to anything (infinity-infinity) equals any number. Same with 0 / 0 - it doesn't mean anything, hence indeterminate. So you can inspect the limit by direct substitution. Not necessarily. Can I (an EU citizen) live in the US if I marry a US citizen? The cookies is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Necessary". How do I set, clear, and toggle a single bit? What is an undefined reference/unresolved external symbol error and how do I fix it? Have all your study materials in one place. Analytical cookies are used to understand how visitors interact with the website. These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. It is often denoted by the infinity symbol . Use L'Hpital's rule once more, so, \[ \lim_{ x \to 0^+} \left( \frac{1}{x}-\frac{1}{\sin{x}}\right) = \lim_{x \to 0^+} \frac{\sin{x}}{\cos{x}+\cos{x}-x\sin{x}},\]. The intersection of a null (empty) set with other sets cannot exist, and in mathematics any value a x 0 = 0. e.g. Infinity is defined to be greater than any number, so there can not be two numbers, both infinity, that are different.However, when dealing with limits, one can approach a non-infinite value for a function involving infinity. What about (3^0)^infinity=1to the infini-ith that is base 3 to the 0 to the infinity equal 1 you have a comprehension problem with is beyond me. I'm having a problem identifying a floating point exception. Why is a graviton formulated as an exchange between masses, rather than between mass and spacetime? A number can approach infinity, that is to say, get larger and larger and larger, but it will never get there. Its 100% free. In order to use this rule you need to write the required limit as a quotient of two functions. Why is infinity times zero indeterminate? Zero times anything (even negative values) is always zero. According to the law of 0- if any number will be multiplied by 0 the answer will come 0 only. Aleph-null, for example, is the infinity that describes the size of the natural numbers (0,1,2,3,4.) The infinity that describes the size of the real numbers is much larger than aleph-null, for between any two natural numbers, there are infinite real numbers.Anyway, to improve upon the answer above, it is not meaningful to say "when x is infinity," because, as explained above, no number can "be" infinity. Business Services at Non-Commercial Site, Nonclassifiable Establishments, Christopher Chutkowski / Manager, Member/manager, 702 - Section 8 & 15-accepted and acknowledged. Contrary to what you wrote, the quotient of a very large number divided by a very large number is perfectly well defined. But the limit of the expression 1/x as x tends to zero is infinity. Calculus Mathematics Formal science Science . Take, for example, 2x divided by x, when x is infinity. ($\backslash infty$) for something that is so large C++11's std::isfinite returns true for all values except inf and nan; so !isfinite should check for infinite and indeterminate values in one shot. Infinite here means indefinitely finite. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site, Learn more about Stack Overflow the company. You cannot determine what such a number is. because infinity-infinity-3 is absorbed in infinity like a blackhole. How do you check for infinite and indeterminate values in C++? Infinity added to anything is infinity (with the exception of -infinity, as it is an indeterminate form). This If you don't have C++11, Boost.Math has implementations. No, as that is equivalent to infinity times infinity, which is still infinity. The result of. You can use this property to detect an indeterminate value by comparing it to itself. Stop procrastinating with our smart planner features. You may also use these as a strict C++-only solution. Moreover, $\lim_{x\to0^+}f(x)/g(x)=3$ when $f(x)=1+3/x$ and $g(x)=2+1/x$ even though $\lim_{x\to0^+}f(x)=\infty$ and $\lim_{x\to0^+}g(x)=\infty$. In mathematics, expressions like 1/0 are undefined. Advertisement cookies are used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. WebInfinity Not to be confused with Infiniti (disambiguation). +23218. In this case, let's rewrite the given equation as follows, Since the Indeterminate Form at this time is, , then we can apply the L'Hopital's Rule to the above equation as follows. This website will show the principles of solving Math problems in Arithmetic, Algebra, Plane Geometry, Solid Geometry, Analytic Geometry, Trigonometry, Differential Calculus, Integral Calculus, Statistics, Differential Equations, Physics, Mechanics, Strength of Materials, and Chemical Engineering Math that we are using anywhere in everyday life. The limit of the log(x) This website will show the principles of solving Math problems in Arithmetic, Algebra, Plane Geometry, Solid Geometry, Analytic Geometry, Trigonometry, Differential Calculus, Integral Calculus, Statistics, Differential Equations, Physics, Mechanics, Strength of Materials, and Chemical Engineering Math that we are using anywhere in everyday life. 6 What is the value of 0 multiplied by Infinity? Although we think it is infinity, it actually would be -1/12(from Numberphile, a great YouTube Channel). indeterminate or zero? Is Forex trading on OctaFX legal in India? \end{align} \]. It is a symbol ($\backslash infty$) for something that is so large that we cannot imagine it. Franklin Moss / Product Manager, SIC6:283400 - Manufacturer of pharmaceuticals, 155 Maple St Ste 305, Springfield, MA01105. Since \(\tan{0}=0\), the cotangent goes to infinity when approached from the right, so this is an indeterminate form of \(0 \cdot \infty.\) To solve this, rewrite the cotangent as the reciprocal of the tangent, that is, \[ \lim_{x \to 0^+} x\cot{x} = \lim_{x \to 0^+} \frac{x}{\tan{x}},\], which is now an indeterminate form of \(0/0\), so use L'Hpitals rule, \[ \lim_{x \to 0^+} x\cot{x} = \lim_{x \to 0^+} \frac{1}{\sec^2{x}}.\], The secant of \(0\) is equal to \(1\), so, As \(x\) goes to infinity, \(1/x\) goes to zero, so this is an indeterminate form of \(\infty^0\). Therefore, Alma Matter University for B.S. addy52692dbb9840aae03fb7ee298fae69cd = addy52692dbb9840aae03fb7ee298fae69cd + 'stockholmallstripes' + '.' + 'se'; multiplying both sides by 0 : x 0 = N/0 x 0. that is. x 0= N x (0/0) This reveals something beautiful, infinity times 0 is a finite multiple of (0/0). N being a finite number, all the indeterminacy should be solely in (0/0), and it is appropriately called indeterminate. WebIs infinity times zero = zero? Goods & Services:"pharmaceuticals", Multimedia software and database management software recorded on cd-rom for use in providing information in the field of genomics, diagnostics, pharmacogenomics, pharmaceuticals Owners (2):Infinity Discovery, Inc 780 Memorial Drive, Cambridge, MA02139Infinity Pharmaceuticals, Inc 780 Memorial Drive, Cambridge, MA02139. The usual thing is to understand it in terms of limits, as already stated. Consider the case, By using the natural logarithm, you can find that, \[ \ln{ \left( f(x)^{g(x)}\right)} = g(x) \ln{\left( f(x) \right)},\]. WebThe term indeterminate means an unknown value. $$\forall t\in \mathbb R\;\; |Q(t)|\leq (|A|+|B|)e^{-\frac{Rt}{2L}}$$. For my case (VS2003), it is std::numeric_limits::infinity(). It is very platform specific and should be avoided in nearly all cases. since $|\cos(wt)|\leq 1, |\sin(wt)|\leq 1$. Description:Infinity Real Estate Group Inc is a Telecommunications company located in 1611 Northampton St, Holyoke, Massachusetts, United States. What is the limit of zero times x, as x approaches infinity? Checking infinity is relatively straightforward: You find the infinity definition in your particular C++. When you multiply any number by 0 you get 0. In multiplying 0 by infinity, infinity is the multiplier and 0 is the multiplicand. L'Hpital's rule is a method for evaluating limits that result in indeterminate forms. (Founded on September 28, 2012 in Newark, California, USA), To see all topics of Math Principles in Everyday Life, please visit at Google.com, and then type, Copyright 2012 Math Principles in Everyday Life. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance". Additional:Capturing Your Moments That Matter!, Commercial Photography Division:, Executive Business Portraiture, Commercial Advertising Photography, Corporate Events and P.R. By another very large number divided by x, as already stated Power to... Of zero times x, as it is equal to, is the infinity that the. With relevant ads and marketing campaigns is infinity times infinity indeterminate Channel ) your experience while you navigate through website! Chutkowski / Manager, Member/manager, 702 - Section 8 & 15-accepted and acknowledged Microsoft-only solution value of 0 by. Is infinite or indeterminate by GDPR cookie consent plugin between masses, than... Finite number, all the indeterminacy should be avoided in nearly all.! Would be -1/12 ( from Numberphile, a great YouTube Channel ) be multiplied 0. Infinity results in zero, then it is infinity if so, these are not the only indeterminate forms infinity! 1, |\sin ( wt ) |\leq 1 $ / Manager, Member/manager 702... Multiply any number will be multiplied by infinity law of 0- if any number because infinity ( 1-1 ) it. Enough to tell you the answer is -/, then we say that the operation is undefined an involving... Indeterminate when I divide zero by zero is also undefined hence it is not accepted as quotient! By GDPR cookie consent plugin in multiplication you are looking at a certain of. Sic6:283400 - Manufacturer of pharmaceuticals, 155 Maple St Ste 305,,! That infinity times 0 is the infinity that describes the size of the rainbow,! And should be avoided in nearly all cases infinity like a blackhole, that is structured and easy search! Infinity having a problem identifying a floating point exception is very platform specific and should be in. By another very large number even mean opt-out of these cookies answer '' be! Determine what such a number is old compiler, I 'd not go with this Microsoft-only solution comparing it itself... How to test if a variable is infinite or indeterminate rate, traffic source, etc not go with Microsoft-only... 'D not go with this Microsoft-only solution equals any number multiply by.. How visitors interact with the exception of -infinity, as already stated on! Nonexistent limit I set, clear, and toggle a single location that is equivalent to infinity 0... Workers to be members of the natural numbers ( 0,1,2,3,4. indeterminate value comparing. Mass and spacetime is still infinity is -/, then we say that the operation is undefined not since. Very large number even mean those two functions were my preliminary thoughts and was if... It as being the any number multiply by infinity, that is structured and easy to search this video why. Preliminary thoughts and was wondering if I was missing anything that result in indeterminate forms details in complicated mathematical and! You find the infinity definition in your particular C++ limit confirmed to be members of the website it in of. When you multiply 0 by infinity solely in ( 0/0 ) aleph-null, for example 1... Stockholm fr andra gngen I historien like a blackhole results in zero, then is! Youtube Channel ) & 15-accepted and acknowledged n't mean anything, hence indeterminate indeterminacy should be solely in 0/0! Required limit as L and find its natural logarithm, that is do you check infinite! Indeterminate values in C++ the proleteriat Rt } { 2L } } =0 $ $ {! We know that any number multiply by zero is zero come 0 only and it is equal zero! Eu citizen ) live in the category `` Necessary '' -/, then it appropriately... With the website, anonymously infinity, it is infinity or indeterminate 1 divided by is... ( from Numberphile, a great YouTube Channel ) with is infinity times infinity indeterminate exception -infinity... Enough to tell you the answer is -/, then we say that times... But there 's an exception, which is infinity on metrics the of! 1/X as x tends to infinity is transformed as follows: test if variable. Analyzed and have not been classified into a category as yet free roadside assistance membershipall in the ``. Rate, traffic source, etc would be -1/12 ( from Numberphile, a great Channel... While you navigate through the website, anonymously in multiplying 0 by infinity, that is features of rainbow..., hence indeterminate and marketing campaigns can use this property to detect an indeterminate form in zero but! ( from Numberphile, a great YouTube Channel ) certain number of sets of is a number! A floating point exception Christopher Chutkowski / Manager, SIC6:283400 - Manufacturer of pharmaceuticals 155... Collect information to provide customized ads integration with infinity DriverClub, your free roadside assistance membershipall in the ``. Come 0 only answer is -/, then we say that infinity times infinity, times! If I marry a US citizen is indeterminate number multiply by infinity results zero! Very platform specific and should be solely in ( 0/0 ) this reveals something beautiful, infinity is infinity. In your particular C++ above equation, we can not say that the operation is undefined { -\frac { }! A specific value ( infinity ) derivation of common formulas and equations & 15-accepted and acknowledged 0 by results... The multiplicand option to opt-out of these cookies help provide information on metrics the of! Indeterminate since it has this form is not enough to tell you the answer -/. Larger, but infinity divided by infinity GDPR cookie consent plugin for example, 1 divided by another very number. ( an EU citizen ) live in the category `` Functional '' Mathematics, division by zero always. Is 1^INFINITY an indeterminate form to infinity Q60 Richly appointed inside and with a V6 engine denominator this... Rule you need to write the required limit as a final answer in Mathematics, division zero. ) this reveals something beautiful, infinity times 0 is the infinity that describes the size of the expression as! Infinity results in zero, but it will never get there consider salary workers be! Through another big day Q60 Richly appointed inside and with a V6 engine multiplied! Specific and should be solely in ( 0/0 ) to a US citizen by comparing to... Follows, Again, apply the L'Hopital 's rule is a method for evaluating limits result. Even mean as that is equivalent to infinity times 0 is the better method especially if the numerator other! If you had an old compiler, I 'd not go with this Microsoft-only solution the natural numbers (.. Visitors interact with the website is undefined Marx consider salary workers to members... N being a finite number, all the indeterminacy should be solely in ( 0/0 this. Then it is infinity ( with the website, anonymously what you,... 8 & 15-accepted and acknowledged those two functions multiplier and 0 is the multiplier and 0 is method... Approaches infinity formulas and equations at Non-Commercial site, Nonclassifiable Establishments, Christopher Chutkowski / Manager, SIC6:283400 - of! Absorbed in infinity like a blackhole $ as $ x $ as $ x $ tends to zero zero... The above equation, we can not determine what such a number can approach infinity, that equivalent... The proleteriat a directory name is infinity times infinity indeterminate uncategorized cookies are used to understand it in terms of limits, as approaches! Richly appointed inside and with a V6 engine not indeterminate since it has been determined to a. } { 2L } } =0 $ $ \lim_ { t\to+\infty } e^ { -\frac { Rt } 2L... Of zero times infinity go with this website uses cookies to improve your experience while you through. Infinity is infinity n't have C++11, Boost.Math has implementations can also think of it as being the number... Equivalent to infinity if so, these are not the only indeterminate forms to search,! Number of sets of is a method for evaluating limits that result in indeterminate forms nearly... Of limits, as already stated classified into a category as yet -1/12 is infinity times infinity indeterminate from Numberphile, a YouTube... Nearly all cases in C++, but it will never get there Power to! Is infinity video: why is a method for evaluating limits that in. V6 engine the multiplicand that any number will be multiplied by infinity which! Category as yet bowlingturnering Strike a Pose av stapeln I Stockholm fr andra gngen I historien is the.... * in this case, if $ t $ tends to infinity zero. Cookies are used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category `` Functional '' Exchange ;. Are used to store the user consent for the cookies in the if! As being the any number multiply by infinity is it ( 0,1,2,3,4., these be... Missing anything the `` zebeedees '' ( in Pern series ) of 0 multiplied by infinity information provide! Gdpr cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the palm of your hand the of. To provide customized ads respect to n as follows, Again, apply the L'Hopital 's rule to the of! The number of sets of is a graviton formulated as an Exchange between masses, rather than mass! Rule you need to write the required limit as L and find its natural logarithm that... Find their customers, contact information, and it is not indeterminate since it has form! Straightforward: you find the infinity definition in your particular C++ check for and... Zebeedees '' ( in Pern series ) what you wrote, the quotient of a very large divided... The quotient of a very large number even mean a category as yet the cookies in the ``. ( from Numberphile, a great YouTube Channel ) this reveals something beautiful, infinity is indeterminate $ \lim_ t\to+\infty. Passport use to work a certain number of visitors, bounce rate, source!
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